Response from ‘The assholes at Creative Loafing’
July 20th, 2007 by Wade Tatangelo in NewsKeith Ulrey, who helms Tampa indie label New Granada Records and is a member of the local band Zillionaire, recently sent a missive that began: “To the assholes at Creative Loafing.” In it, he criticized my music coverage, particularly my local music coverage. He also pointed out an error in my write-up of the New Granada band the Candy Bars and my mistake regarding a mix-up between the two Zillionaire bands registered on MySpace (one is based in Rhode Island, the other is Ulrey’s.)
The Candy Bars error was corrected online as soon as Ulrey contacted me. Incidentally, The Candy Bars entry has also been updated (as of Sun., July 22) with a statement sent to me from their former cellist Melissa Grady (formerly Melissa Castellano). Here’s the correction that’s running regarding my foolish Zillionaire mistake: “A Music Week entry in the July 18-24 edition of Creative Loafing incorrectly stated that the Rhode Island band Zillionaire would be opening for Richard Buckner Fri., July 20, at New World Brewery in Ybor City. Zillionaire, of Tampa, is the one scheduled to perform.â€
My goal is to be accurate. Period. But mistakes do happen. The only thing I can ask is for people to alert me of them. Errors will be corrected as soon as possible.
Ulrey also questioned my qualifications. I started as staff writer/music critic at Creative Loafing in February. Before that I was music writer for Weekly Planet Sarasota, correspondent for the St. Petersburg Times and Sarasota Herald-Tribune as well as staff writer/music critic for the Bradenton Herald, where my music stories ran in publications such as the Chicago Tribune, Houston Chronicle and Denver Post. I have also written for national magazines such as the alt-country tome No Depression. My local coverage began in 2001 while I was at the University of South Florida Tampa campus editing The Oracle’s Off Limits entertainment section.
Since returning to Tampa after a four-year hiatus, I have made a concerted effort to immerse myself in the local original music scene. Admittedly, I still have a ways to go before I’m familiar with each and every one of the myriad bands that enrich the area. It should also be noted that a significant part of my job is staying abreast of the national scene, especially indie buzz bands coming to town like Bloc Party, Silversun Pickups, Dr. Dog and Deerhoof, all of which I interviewed. Same goes for alternative rock icon Les Claypool and the phoner I scored with Little Richard, the hippest legend in rock ’n’ roll.
Music Week (which is continued here), our two-page installment dedicated to upcoming shows, is rife with write-ups of local bands. For instance, 21 of the 26 entries in the July 18 edition include items about Tampa Bay and Sarasota bands.
Two of my past three music features have been profiles of Tampa Bay acts (Car Bomb Driver, July 11; Steve Connelly, July 4). In addition to the Car Bomb and Connelly pieces, I have done features on area luminaries like Geri X and Military Junior. Our music issue, which was published April 11, included profiles of the “Top 10 Women Musicians in Tampa Bay.â€
I also have written numerous in-depth concert reviews of local acts including the Americana Fest at Skipper’s Smokehouse (July 18); Summer Jam III at Crowbar and New World Brewery (June 27); hardcore Tampa rapper Jersey at Crowbar (June 20); and SMAsh 8: A benefit for SMAsh Radio at The Garage (March 28), among others.
Finally, every week in our Spins section I review a CD released by a local band. Tampa’s proggy, mostly instrumental quintet Red Room Cinema earned a three of out five star review in the July 18 issue.
Another repository for local music info and commentary is my Creative Loafing sanctioned music blog that can be found at TampaCalling.com. A recent post (“Jannus Landing: Too good for tribute shows,” July 19), argues that St. Pete’s most venerable venue is selling itself short by booking acts like the AC/DC Tribute Show — Highway to Heel, which arrives Sept. 8.
Incidentally, heaping praise on every local band in town, as is the case with a couple other area publications, is not what is expected of me from my editors. Our goal is to offer readers thoughtful criticism that will both steer potential concertgoers in the right direction, and maybe, for those musicians open to criticism, inspire the local talent to strive even harder to perhaps one day make Tampa known nationally for something other than our infamous death metal scene.
I greatly appreciate feedback. Even more so when I make a factual error so I can correct it immediately. Keep in mind, though, certain responses only undermine the overall message.
“Fuck you Creative Loafing,†concludes Ulrey. “You can take a shit and eat it.â€
All I can say is no one here at Creative Loafing will be doing anything of the sort. But we appreciate the fact that Ulrey cares enough about this publication that it inspired such a strong response.
Here’s Events Editor Leilani Polk’s response to Ulrey’s claim that his New Granada Presents press releases arrive before deadline but then are ignored:
I’m very sorry you’re upset. However, there seems to be some confusion regarding what happened in regards to you sending your show info to the paper on time.
A few months ago, I had a conversation with Phil Benito in which he told me that you (New Granada Presents) were unhappy that your shows weren’t making it into the paper. Because I personally receive all the event info that’s submitted via the website, I was quite familiar with you as I’d consistently received your info after our deadlines. (FYI: This was before my email address was added to your mailing group.)
I gave my business card to Benito and told him to tell you to email your shows to me directly, and that’s when I started getting direct emails from you. I’ve mostly received your show info on time ever since, and if you looked at the Soundboard Section of the paper, you’d find that your show info was included.
Music Week listings are compiled at the discretion of our music writer, and at no time did I make any guarantees that yours would appear in this part of the paper. I can guarantee that when you send your show info on time, it will always appear in our Soundboard listings.
Feel free to email me at leilani.polk@creativeloafing.com or call me with any questions at 813-739-4800.
Send to a friend:
July 21st, 2007 at 3:30 pm
Telling CL to “take a shit and eat it” is rather dramatic! I don’t have much to say regarding Mr. Urley’s specific gripes, except to note that I, personally, would like to see more coverage of New Granada shows in the Music Week section and I’m glad the paper was willing to quickly correct the errors regarding Zillionaire and Candy Bars.
I would, however, like to register my disappointment with the music section of late. To be blunt, I don’t think you are meeting your stated goal of offering readers “thoughtful criticism that will both steer potential concertgoers in the right direction, and maybe, for those musicians open to criticism, inspire the local talent to strive even harder to perhaps one day make Tampa known nationally”. Specifically, I’m irked by Wade Tatangelo’s seeming disdain for nearly any music that strays from conventionality.
I first grew alarmed by the April 4th concert review that praised a band for being accessible while attacking an “aging hipster” in the audience for call the same band… accessible. The same review then dismissed another band apparently for merely dissonant. Since then nearly every issue contains at least one potshot at straw-man hipsters. A recent example is a CD review which ended by stating it “is a product of Sub Pop (early Nirvana and Soundgarden, The Postal Service, The Shins), which means in certain circles, it’s already a must-own. 2.5 stars.” The music may in fact be lousy, but what’s the label got to do with it? Mr. Tatangelo really believes people will buy it because it shares a label with the disparate bands mentioned? The frequent hipster-bashing leads me to think he was traumatized as a child by hoodlums in white belts and vintage T-shirts.
Even when writing about so-called indie bands without outright contempt, he betrays a patent disinterest. His description of both Red Room Cinema and Six Parts Seven as “shoegaze” in the last issue makes me wonder if he knows what the term means.
I don’t expect or want a critic to merely rubber-stamp music deemed fashionable, and I’m grateful when good writing forces me to reassess my own opinions. But I’ve yet to see the promised “thoughtful criticism” from Mr. Tatangelo. (For God’s sake, the last music column consisted of years-old anecdotes.) Perhaps the Creative Loafing could consider handing over coverage of the more adventurous music to staff writers would won’t have a knee-jerk negative reaction to it.
July 21st, 2007 at 4:19 pm
Oh, Wade. Always the rabble-rouser aren’t you.
Chin up buddy. There are those of us who know for a fact that you’re trying your damndest at benefitting the scene whilst delivering thoughtful write-ups. I for one appreciate it.
Everybody makes mistakes..everyone has room to grow. I know I do.
Keep goin..don’t let up
Cheers.
July 21st, 2007 at 7:43 pm
Why the FUCK are you having to defend yourself and apologize? This is ridiculous. Can we take this rebuttal and all it’s subsequent comments down immediately?
And no offense to Keith, but the next time a whiny promoter (myself included) sends you a complaint, tell them to either send their materials in on time and to the right person or send it to the other publications that won’t even be around in another couple years.
It seems like bands and promoters should be smiling more and politic-ing to get their events printed and not biting the hand that feeds them.
It’s truly embarrasing as an artist and is not setting the right example for the ones coming up.
July 21st, 2007 at 9:17 pm
Creative Loafing asshole problem? See sendahole.com.
July 22nd, 2007 at 1:40 am
What you eat is really of no interest to most of us, Wade Tangelo. And on that note, your food write-ups leave something to be desired. Like good taste.
I want to ask you a question. How did you decide on which band was playing the New Granada show? There are several bands on myspace named Zillionaire. One from Cleveland, one from London, one from “,” (ah, myspace), the one from Providence and of course our local heroes as well.
You should have cared enough to ask somebody. The problem in your writing is that it’s apparent that you don’t care. Or you only care about big name bands who travel through and have more indie “cred” than bands from around here.
Apparently, you’re bored and you’d be better off working for a bank or something. Until you figure out why you love music so much and how to support the musical explosion that is happening all around you, you should really consider being, at least, more considerate.
July 22nd, 2007 at 3:04 am
Does the application for this position require the music critic to kiss the ass of every breathing person in Tampa that can play an instrument in a group in public? What if they really do suck? What if their music really is boring? Does living in Tampa mean that every critic must think you are sound good because you pay taxes here?
July 22nd, 2007 at 3:49 am
it’s the same story over and over again with this crap.
let’s face it; tampa will never, NEVER be a fantastic music town regardless of the quality of the writing/criticism of our “music critics” or the myriad talents of our local “scene.”
the “music industry” at large will ALWAYS ignore us…
we should all just call it a day.
cheers.
July 22nd, 2007 at 9:36 am
This seems like a rather weak reply to the criticism presented to Mr. Tatangelo.
Even though you corrected the mistakes that were printed, the question I present is this: Should it really have happened in the first place? You cant expect me to believe that you had absolutely no idea that there is a band in Tampa named zillionaire? And as far as your profiles of local acts goes, i’m just not seeing a lot of musical diversity in that department.
Also, an interview with “indie buzz band” Bloc Party? I can pick up just about ANY music magazine in existence and find an interview with Bloc Party. How about something a little more daring.
In your opinion,is giving Red Room Cinema’s new CD 3 out of 5 stars really some bold move on your behalf that needs to be mentioned in this rebuttal? I guess that’s why in your Summer Jam III article you mentioned that “On record, the five-piece often sounds flaccid”
Where’s Tom Roe when you need him?
1. Dear Jordan, I hardly think the music writing at CL is the hand that feeds Keith and New Granada. Wouldn’t that be the fans of their artists? Thats just my opinion.
2. Dear Joanna, If you had taken the time to actually read Keith’s letter you would have known that it has nothing to do with getting “his ass kissed” by local critics.
July 22nd, 2007 at 10:22 am
hmmm i was gonnago through this section by section however i got completely stopped at
“…Red Room Cinema earned a three of out five star review in the July 18 issue.”
see guys! he does care about music. his proof is in his 0 to five star ranking system!
also, 3 is average right(i guess simply above average) .
is he bragging that he gave rrc a 3 or is it a bigger statement of the overall quality of the tampa music?
i’m gonna really try not to flame this guy, but i’m sure he’s a fan of the urbane cowboys.
July 22nd, 2007 at 10:34 am
ok, one more.
qouth:
“All I can say is no one here at Creative Loafing will be doing anything of the sort. But we appreciate the fact that Ulrey cares enough about this publication that it inspired such a strong response.”
retort:
fuck you, and your bullshit third grade reverse psychology. he cares not about the publication, but about the need for a decent, well informed publication.
hopefully he realizes that 80 percent of the bullshit content published in your rag is simply part of the giant “alternative” news machine[i know a number of extremely republican people who sit on the board of creative loafing,inc).
the 20% that is local news, is the area you get to type for.
basically, he’s saying you’re unqualified for the job.
July 22nd, 2007 at 10:47 am
In response to the idea that it’s the music that’s lacking here, not the coverage, I’d like to say… ain’t no way in hell.
Tampa has a long history of producing many inventive independent musicians and bands. The fact that this is not a huge urban hub like New York or San Francisco produces a more laid-back environment where people can express themselves freely.
No matter what genre (or lack thereof), you’re into when it comes to music, there’s a venue, restraunt, street corner, or even a practice space somewhere that offers live performances of what you’re into.
And if you’re still not into it, don’t rheem musicians for trying to get fair and accurate representation of their work & performance dates. Go make something substantial on your own instead of accusing the rest of us of seeking ass kissings.
July 22nd, 2007 at 12:14 pm
Interesting Sunday morning on the blog.
I’m guessing I’m not the only one here nursing a hangover so why don’t we take a stab at making this civil and productive. I am interested in the feedback. But I must also defend myself when misinformation is given, just like I had to eat a big slice of humble pie when my dumbass wrote about the Zillionaire from Rhode Island.
John G offered a considerate comment that reads: “I first grew alarmed by the April 4th concert review [http://tampa.creativeloafing.com/gyrobase/Content?oid=oid%3A221666] that praised a band for being accessible while attacking an ‘aging hipster’ in the audience for call[ing] the same band… accessible.â€
Let me clarify. The “aging hipster†used “accessible†as a put down. I think that’s clear in the context of the quote:
“After the performance, most of the people in attendance seemed to agree that we had witnessed something rather special. Of course, certain people are just too cool for a little fun.
‘It’s accessible,’ quipped one aging hipster.
I shook my head in frustration.”
The reason “I shook my head in frustration†is that the “aging hipsters†dissed a band (The Modern Skirts, an unsigned act from Athens that deserves to be in heavy rotation on radio stations nationwide) for making music that without compromising an iota of integrity is delightfully infectious. The “aging hipster’s†comment, which wasn’t rebuked by any of the New World regulars seated at his table, troubled me.
It got me worrying that such an attitude could be what, in part, at least, keeps Tampa Bay a nonentity on the national music scene. I wondered how many local original music bands — most of which draw, on average, no more than 50 people to any given gig — are eschewing the basic tenants of timeless pop music and/or dirtying up their sound in order to avoid the uncool label of “accessible†and impress people like the “aging hipster.â€
That is why I concluded my Modern Skirts review by musing: “the Tampa Bay music scene suffers from a fear of ‘accessibility,’ which could account for us failing to produce more acts like the Modern Skirts and The Sugar Oaks, two bands that are not afraid to connect with people on an emotional level.â€
John G also remarks that I have “disdain for nearly any music that strays from conventionality.†If by straying from conventionality he means bands with lead vocalists who sing off key and guitarist who get lost in a checkerboard of effects pedals while the drummer forgoes actually drumming to make sure the correct bleeps are coming out of the laptop, he’s absolutely right.
Granted, today’s extensive line of music gadgetry can be used for good, too. Radiohead is a prime example. But too often on the local level I see these devices being serving as a crutch for bands that have yet to master basic songwriting and performing skills.
Big Pen writes: “Until you figure out why you love music so much…â€
Be warned: here’s the part where I get sappy. I love music because it’s the only art form that can make a deep, emotional impact in a matter of minutes, sometimes even seconds. Good music hits hard and fast unlike just about anything not delivered via bottle, vial or pill. A sad, honest song is that sympathetic friend reminding you that others have experienced similar pain. Heavy guitar riffs are the perfect anecdote after a hellacious day at the office. A sumptuous ballad can inspire slow dancing between two strangers at last call. Stumbling across an exotic sound for the first time can make one’s day and lead him or her down an amazing new path of discovery.
Big Pen’s comment suggests that if I had a greater love for music — Do I need to submit a photo of CD collection? — I would show more love for the local scene. However, it’s the opposite. Music is too special for me to laud the mediocre, which includes anything that is purposely inaccessible.
Big Pen writes about “a musical explosion that is happening all around [me].â€
I would be betraying Creative Loafing’s readers if I agreed wholeheartedly with that statement. I see sparks but no explosion. Granted, it just so happens that those bands I do rank among the Bay’s elite mostly fall into the “conventional†category.
Well, except for Giddy-Up, Helicopter! Unfortunately, there was that brouhaha I went through with them in regards to what I maintain was a horrible case of miscommunication. Regardless, I consider Giddy-Up a band that is adventurous and unconventional in the very best sense of the words.
In Ulrey’s “eat shit†email he wrote: “Then I read a (rare) featured article on a certain all-girl local band [Giddy-Up, Helicopter!] where the new music writer barely mentioned the music, the influences, the sounds etc. and instead decided to focus the article on the sexual preferences and speculated gender role reversal of said members.â€
I know the Giddy-Up, Helicopter! controversy is old news but considering that Ulrey’s letter is all over MySpace I must again attempt to set the record straight.
The Giddy-Up, Helicopter! feature ran 435 words with only 55 (three sentences) dealing with their sexuality. Here’s the true “focus†of the story:
“The band’s sound wraps indie-rock fuzz around a rock ‘n’ roll heart and employs organic instrumentation that proves a well-played lap steel can sound far more interesting than something programmed on a laptop. Yes, this Sonic Youth-loving quintet is all about the requisite outsider persona and too-cool-for-school ‘tude, but there’s also a warmth to their music that pulls the listener in, especially the mysterious, montage-style lyrics and shy, frail delivery of guitarist/vocalist Jay Conner.â€
Well, my morning coffee rush is fading and I fear that I have already rambled far too long so I’ll wrap it up.
Have I overlooked your band? Send a CD or shoot me a link to your Web site. All I can promise is an honest appraisal from someone with a stronger music background than most and a genuine desire to be blown away every time I slip a fresh disc into the player.
Lastly, running ecstatic profiles and reviews of every band in town ultimately benefits no one — especially the readers of Creative Loafing. It’s a trend among other area publications that I abhor. Bay area bands deserve better than to be coddled.
July 22nd, 2007 at 1:23 pm
This guy certainly spends alot of time defending himself. perhaps he really is that clueless to the fact that he’s the ultimate dumbass. My advice to Mr. tangelo would be maybe it’s time to find another line of work to which he is better suited. he could start by going over to various local band members’ houses and cleaning their gutters while they kick him in the balls. It doesn’t pay much but at least he’ll only look half as stupid as he does now.
July 22nd, 2007 at 3:42 pm
Surely we can avoid personal insults.
First of all, to Joran Slane: he does not, in fact, HAVE to defend himself and apologize, and could in fact do what most critics do when some one tells them to eat shit, which it to ignore it. He chose to post a response on this blog, which allows us to post comments, thereby inviting this discussion, and kudos to Mr. Tatangelo for doing so. Also, I disagree that we should all be politicing to get in the pages of Creative Loafing as you suggest; I hope musical events will be written about on their merits.
By the way, there’s only one problem with the not-going-to-praise-bands-just-because-they’re-local defense that keeps popping up — no one is actually asking for that. Let’s stop knocking down non-existent arguments.
To address Mr. Tatangelo directly:
Not to harp on a three-month old concert review, but I did in fact get that the “aging hipster” was using “accessible” as a put-down. What I don’t get is why you cared. You regularly discuss bands in terms of whether you perceive them as being liked or disliked by “hipsters”, or being hipsters themselves, and I think it gets in the way of your writing. (By the way, if Tampa does someday become known for its music, the first ones on board will the so-called hipsters.) From your own excerpt above about Giddy Up Helicopter: “Yes, this Sonic Youth-loving quintet is all about the requisite outsider persona and too-cool-for-school ‘tude…” What is this “requisite outsider persona”, exactly? What makes you think they’re “too-cool-for-school”? I know this was part of a bigger description of their music, and I don’t mean to use it out of context. My point is that remarks like this are at best filler and at worst suggest the sort of anti-hipster posturing that is more elitist than any “outsider persona”.
As for “unconventionality”, no, I don’t mean bands that write bad songs so they can fiddle with a laptop. It’s rather disingenuous to suggest that I did. The technology vs. songwriting argument is a red herring, but since you bring it up: if in fact so many local bands use technology as a crutch, why not write about that, at least? You’ve waved that accusation around in a general sense but — correct me if I’m wrong — I can’t recall ever seeing it applied to a specific band in a detailed discussion of their music. Sometimes you seem barely able to write about the music at all, and it’s disheartening. You’ve written about Yo Majesty twice (that I’ve seen), and I still haven’t the faintest idea what they sound like, unless it’s the sound of an MC having her tit grabbed. The last feature didn’t even discuss music! I don’t mean to begrudge you the occassional humorous article, but at this point it’s adding to the impression you’re not so interested in music per se.
And I think that impression is probably wrong. I doubt you’d have applied for the job if you didn’t love music. I’d like to see more of that love on the page. It’s got to be tough, slogging through mounds of lousy music week after week (though your and my — or anyone’s — ideas of “lousy” aren’t going to be identical), dealing with limited time and column space. But the previous music writers had the same issues, and no matter how often I may have disagreed with their opinions, I never got the sense they were contemptuous of or disinterested in their subjects.
Thank you for taking the time to engage in this discussion.
July 23rd, 2007 at 10:10 am
What a train wreck.
The only reason I don’t understand why CL needs a music critic is because most of the Tampa music is not really all that good.
I have seen a handful of acts that have blown me away with their innovation or lyrics and many many more that were really great, albeit admittedly background while shouting to friends over beers at new world.
But unfortunately, I have seen and heard more local music in this town that just goes nowhere… literally drives me away from a place if I was already there or watching another band on the bill that had 3 other bands.
I do like what Keith and Jack are doing as far as promoting local music. I think that having a strong network is critical for a band to get a good start and I applaud them for their efforts. I have numerous friends and acquaintances in all aspects of the local scene (from promoter to production to band members to solo artists) and I know how hard it is and how much time and energy they put into a show, an album, a song.
I think if I had only one thing I would like to see change about the local scene is for every one not to take themselves so seriously. Everyone has a different idea of what moves them and what makes for a good time. Go out and play and have fun while you are at it.
July 23rd, 2007 at 12:21 pm
Right on, jj.
July 23rd, 2007 at 12:50 pm
jj, I agree with you 100 percent. Too many local musicians take themselves way, way too seriously. We’re Tampa, people, not Chicago, not Atlanta, and certainly not New York. DEFLATE YOUR EGOS, PEOPLE AND GET A GRIP. Wade made a mistake. He not only admitted to this mistake, but he took the time to respond to Ulrey’s entire juvenile email — which was, to be perfectly frank, full of inaccuracies, a fact that certain folks fail to recognize. If you were to read his MySpace rant, you’d find the same email he sent to Wade, almost verbatim, but with a little paragraph at the end giving a huge shout-out “to a certain unnamed writer at TBT for her continuing support and weekly features on local bands, local shows and the general hype on what’s happening right here in our own town.” I don’t want to add fuel to the fire, but when did the corporately-owned TBT and its writers ever provide any meaningful critical analysis of the local music scene? It’s not the job of a music writer to pile heaps of praise on and kiss the asses of bands who aren’t necessarily worthy, no matter how much they are trying to create a scene. But of course, you like the paper that tells you you’re great even if your music sucks stinky ass.
It’s stuff like this that encourages music writers to NOT write about local bands and personally, I don’t blame them.
July 23rd, 2007 at 7:23 pm
What the fuck is “Creative Loafing?”
July 23rd, 2007 at 8:19 pm
Brain and jj, dead on! Too many big egos, not enough good music to back them up. Not that I don\\\’t think there are plenty of good local bands — I love several. But the bands I love would probably laugh something like this off, send a letter to Wade, and move on with their lives. At least, I\\\’d like to think so…
July 24th, 2007 at 12:09 am
Oh come on — all this moaning about local musicians making crappy music and having big egos? It’s like complaining that dirt is dirty. It’s not a Tampa phenomenon, it’s a universal phenomenal. It’s also beside the point. Pettiness in musicians doesn’t excuse poor coverage in papers. Music writing doesn’t need to “support” a local scene; it IS part of a scene, and ought to strive for the same standards of quality that we demand of the music.
And again: no one is actually suggesting that a local paper should automatically praise all local music. Despite the intimations above, even the tbt doesn’t do that. It runs factual meet-the-band profiles. True, it isn’t meaningful critical analysis, but neither is most of what’s coming out of CL’s music section right now. To be fair, it’s undoubtedly difficult to cram meaningful analysis into three-sentence concert listings and CD reviews, but right or wrong many of us in the area expect more from Creative Loafing than a corporate daily that rips half of its articles from slate.com. If this were about simple typos and missed deadlines, I suspect everyone would have laughed it off themselves.
July 24th, 2007 at 10:02 am
I think the horse is sufficiently beaten.
July 24th, 2007 at 10:21 am
W.W.S.H.D.
(What would Scott Harrell do?)
July 24th, 2007 at 3:54 pm
Why do you people care? just sell your computers, buy your heroin and go about your rock and roll lives
“Oh, it doesn’t matter what they say in the papers
`Cause it’s always been the same old scene.
There’s a new band in town.
But you can’t get the sound from a story in a magazine…
Aimed at your average teen.”
- Billy Joel
July 25th, 2007 at 12:48 am
it’s funny how john g. brings up some pretty valid(and well written)points about this blog in general, and yet it just gets answered by snarky comments and half witted remarks about the local scene.lord forbid anyone actually engages in an intelligent conversation about the said subject.
complain all you want about this scene, and how the local music sucks and so forth and so forth.but, i will say this…there is a lot of amazing musicians in this town.a lot of daring musicians.(who use effects, hide behind effects and whatever.sounds good.who cares.)they may not have all the tools(ala, songwriting, performance, etc.etc.)but that’s not really the point of making music anyways.they get up there and play for many appreciative people in tampa who actually give a damn about local(and all.)music.people who want to see the next thing, or just some friends doing what they love.no need to jump off speakers and/or write the perfect love song to make their point musically.it’s just music.i could really care less if someone stares at their shoes while singing slightly off key or does the whole rock star thing, and pretends he really means it while doing his rock star kicks.if it moves people, including myself, than it’s fucking great.
all this bitching just sounds petty and jealous.
pick up a guitar.write a song.start a band.get back to me.
most of the critics can’t.they would rather bitch about someone else’s art than do any of their own.
go to shows.if you don’t like it, that’s your deal.no big whoop.each or his/her own.if you do, yay.awesome.just leave the disdain and negative “i’m better than this” attitude alone.
July 25th, 2007 at 12:48 pm
Just for the record. And I will say ahead of time that everything is subjective. But to make a blanket statement that the Tampa music scene is lacking with no good bands…. that’s not true. You may be a fan of certain bands or certain kinds of music and one may have the opinion not to enjoy a band or think they downright suck. But, there are plenty of good, hardworking (and most importantly on the local level, respected) bands in the Tampa area:
Auto!Automatic!!
Red Room Cinema
Candy Bars
The Diviners
Zillionaire
Giddy Up! Helicopter
Jarvik7
Life of Pi
Win Win Winter
New Bruises
Just to name a few, very eclectic selection i know.
July 26th, 2007 at 12:59 am
omg so is it just me, or was that the most shameless advertisement ever? nice sticking your own band in there. you’re not biased at all.
July 26th, 2007 at 10:29 am
Thanks for opening up CL, TBT and REAX and making sure we could all read.
July 26th, 2007 at 3:54 pm
what drama. i almost made it to the end of the post…. the comments/wankfest are almost as bad as the original tit-for-tat whining blog post. write what you know, keep it real, and stop bitching.
July 26th, 2007 at 6:07 pm
I’ve got 2 cents and at the same time maybe no sense at all but regardless, I’ve looked all over this site and I honestly can’t find a full copy of the email that Mr. Ulrey sent Weakly Loafing. Where is it? Can someone provide the url? Yeah, I’ve found the excerpts from this email scattered about here and there but where’s the whole thing? I did find a copy of said email that appears @ http://blog.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=blog.view&friendID=19418744&blogID=289627821
, but that isn’t on this site. I’d appreciate knowing it’s location on the WL site just so I can read it in full. Maybe it isn’t on this site at all, if that’s the case, good job Weakly! Anyways, I really did a double-take when I first read this gig-listing last week. I thought it was a strange coincidence that another Zillionaire was going to be playing in Tampa, at NWB too, no less, but what I found even stranger was the absence of a line in the listing that went something like this - “This band isn’t the band of the same name from right here in Tampa.”. I expected to see something like that in the listing because, well, there is a band from Tampa called Zillionaire, they do play out semi-frequently, people (apparently not all people) know who they are and who wouldn’t be even a little bit dissipointed to go to a show expecting to see one band only to end up paying to see another one with the same name. “Our goal is to offer readers thoughtful criticism that will both steer potential concertgoers in the right direction,” - no goal scored on this count. Granted, “Fuck you Creative Loafing, you can take a shit and eat it.”, might not be the politest way to express how someone feels about all this but I don’t think it’s uncalled for either because it was such a sloppy goof-up. Try using the seach feature on this website with “zillionaire” in the input box, I did. What did I get, uhhh, I got a bunch of listings and short blurbs all about the Tampa band Zillionaire, each of those listings came from (pre-Wade) issues of this publication but still, they’re all found here and without corrections so they must be accurate to some degree, right? Lastly (because I’ve surely wasted enough time on this already), I never thought that I’d give props to the *tbt but I think they deserve some kind of recognition for the “100 bands from the Tampa area” extended feature that they had a couple of months ago, first time I’d ever seen anything of that scope in a local publication and it was probably one of the best “gifts” to local musicians and local music fans alike, it made the whole “10 chicks that rock” (don’t get me started on that mess, please) issue of this publication pale in comparison. Chickenbutt!
July 26th, 2007 at 7:04 pm
I figured this was a dead horse, too, but this week’s issue tied puppet string to the corpse and worked it like it thought it was Weekend at Bernie’s.
Dration hit some points I’d have made, so I won’t rehash them, except to add that it’s downright sleazy to reduce Keith Urley’s message to four lines of insults yet devote half a column length to a rebuttal. For the few readers of the print issue who bother to check this blog (before this entry gets pushed off the front page) for more information, here’s ALL of what Keith wrote:
“You know… Creative Loafing-Weekly Planet-Creative Loafing has been a part of Tampa counter-culture for a long time. As musicians in the Bay Area, it’s always been fun to pick up the paper and see someone write something nice about your band. Who doesn’t want that? Over the years, there have been several good writers, or at least fans of music if not good writers, and certainly music writers who were familiar with and readily supported the local music scene (ie: Tom Roe, Robert Mortellaro, Scott Harrell to name a few).
“Since the departure of Scott Harrell, there has been a noticeable decline in features on local bands or even mentioning quality shows featuring local bands in their weekly Music Menu.
“It all started when ‘New Granada Presents…’ was told by an outside source that the bi-monthly shows at New World weren’t being featured or mentioned because the information wasn’t getting to the staff in time for their deadline. This is false, as a promoter, I send emails to my media group (including 3 people on the Creative Loafing staff) twice, once 2-3 weeks before a show and one more the week of the show. Then I read a (rare) featured artcle on a certain all-girl local band where the new music writer barely mentioned the music, the influences, the sounds etc. and instead decided to focus the article on the sexual preferences and speculated gender role reversal of said members. Whether true or not, this has nothing to do with the band and the attention the band was/is receiving. Last week, in a small but originally appreciative feature on Candy Bars, Creative Loafing decided to pump up the show (sort of) in the feature, then deflate the band in their online music blog (*focusing on the exiting of cellist Melissa Grady and how the band has “lost it’s secret weapon”). Along with this wishy-washy music writing, the existing band members were also erroneously mis-credited in a role reversal (ie: Ryan on guitar and Daniel on drums).
“I began to wonder what kind of credentials someone needs to write for a local rag and more importantly, a local rag that has a weekly music section tha used to, at least, regularly feature local bands. Why wouldn’t the new person know about Candy Bars, or at least ask someone, like his editor…. Eric Snider…. someone?
“Finally, today I read what may be the icing on the cake. While reading the Music Menu section I saw a write-up/preview of the Friday July 20 show at New World featuring Richard Buckner, The Six Part Seven, Zillionaire and Have Gun Will Travel. It came as a complete shock to read this:
“Rhode Island post-rockers Zillionaire promise ‘experimentations in soulful rock music’ — and judging by the songs they have posted online, do a fairly good job of living up to that boast.”
“Are you fucking kidding me?!?! We all know that with MySpace being so popular you’re bound to find other bands around the nation and world with the same moniker as your own band, your friend’s band, whatever. But, again we have a situation where the assholes at Creative Loafing have not done their homework, or at least did very poor homework. Yes, there’s a bar-rock band in Rhode Island called Zillionaire, but what make CL think this is the band playing New World, when there are no show listings for this band and there just happens to be a local Tampa band (featuring members from other respected local bands like The Washdown, The Maccabees, Versailles, etc.) that has been around for several years and are well respected and liked by their peers.
“Yes, I am in Zillionaire, I am not going to make this seem like I am writing as an outsider looking in. So, this hits home for me. I know plenty of people who say to me, “Who cares what CL has to say?”. It’s just a paper that in recent months has gone downhill so far, it has stopped sliding. But, it’s still bothersome to continue to read again and again write-ups on local bands with misinformation, no information and downright false information.
“I’ve been waiting a long time to say this:
Fuck you Creative Loafing, you can take a shit and eat it.
“Man, that makes me feel so much better.
“Thanks to everyone (for real) that continues to support local music, coming out to shows at New World, Crowbar, Transitions, etc.
And I’m going to give a huge “shout-out” to a certain unnamed writer at TBT for her continuing support and weekly features on local bands, local shows and the general hype on what’s happening right here in our own town. That’s how it should be done.”
July 27th, 2007 at 12:57 pm
Dude, and I thought the theater people hated on your theater critic a little harshly sometimes …
July 27th, 2007 at 5:23 pm
Ok, I’m way late on the comments. But seriously? Forget all the babble about local music good or bad or what other publications are doing. The fact of the matter is that Mr. Wade was hired to do a job. Yes, he was hired by a company to do a certain job just like the rest of the community. When you work at your job you have certain responsibilities and tasks. If you do not fulfill these requirements, you are not doing a good job. What happens when you don’t do a good job at your work? Can you write a small correction to the huge idiotic mistake you have made on numerous occasions and then try to write witty responses on a blog after a night of drinking and asking whichever promoter what to write about the band they didn’t see? Not usually. I wanna know what CL is going to do about Wade. Regardless if you like music or like local bands or whatever the case may be, if I were an editor or publisher my main goal would to be professional and not make huge crazy stupid mistakes. Yes, mistakes do happen. But not like this. A spelling error maybe. I’ve seen a lot of mistakes in CL, but ehh it happens. Wade is just as clumsy as he is a well versed writer. Yes, Leilani Polk wrote Keith a letter about including shows blah blah. Great, good news. Thanks Leilani! What about this idiot doing a bad job? Doesn’t he have a responsibility to you and the readers of CL. People look to this publication. Why? I’m not sure, but they do. So what myspace band story is next? What AES show is next? He can’t even do those right. CL is important to the community, so lets get someone smart writing on a scene that does have hope. Wade, please resign or get your shit together. You’re not helping anyone.